Question

Question

We have had a couple of issues lately with 430 steel used for legs and undershelves being contaminated on sites.  We have tested independently and the only result back is saying that the item is contaminated but not specific.  We have been down the route of checking what the items are being cleaned with and that is all fine.  They are separates sites and on some sites we have old 430 tables next to new 430 tables the old ones are fine and the new ones are showing the contamination.  It is baffling, please could you ask members if anyone is having any similar issues.

We have also spoken to our fabrication company and they cannot answer this either.  Any assistance or similar issues appreciated.

Replies

  1. Two separate sites with the same problem with the same fabricator supplying both? I had a similar issue of contamination being caused by the fabricator grinding in the vicinity of 430g  sheets in their workshop thus covering it with mild steel particles without knowing. I’d be looking at the fabricator or at least asking them to explain how it’s possible.
  2. When they say “contaminated” what do they mean, as I had a customer a year ago that had small rust spots appearing over the surface and undershelves of tabling in the kitchen. The kitchen was not used regularly as it was a small function area.I was advised that these were caused by using bleach products for cleaning..
  3. We have experienced a similar problem on a site last year, we found that the steel had reacted with a sealing agent put on the tiles on the kitchen floor, could be worth checking if the floor has been replaced/sealed recently?
  4. I have spoken to Williams Refrigeration about a similar issue with some of their new cabinets – the adhesive used on the laser wrapping is a different grade and subsequently if not cleaned off on first use it created what looked a lot like rust all over that wouldn’t come off with normal cleaning, was actually dirt mixed with adhesive in the grain of the steel. Sounded like a bad excuse but in fairness it did turn out to be the case and it very much looked like rust, I’ve seen the same thing on fab from CED where 430 is being used.
  5. Yes, we had a similar problem in the last year with wall shelves at a pizza restaurant. They were reported by our client as ‘rusting’ – basically rust coloured discolouration and slight pitting.We queries the sheet quality but the fabricator concerned said they’d had no issues with 430 and ours was a one-off. The client (well known to us) swore that he and his staff were not cleaning down with bleach and were also not placing wet iron trays on the shelves. The ‘staining’ was also appearing on the underside of the shelves. In the end the fabricators did replace the shelves – this was about 6 weeks ago and we’ve heard nothing further, which tends to make us doubt the assurances about the raw material!
  6. I have had this issue where the site has used a high acid floor cleaner with no overnight ventilation, older tables can have a thin coat of ingrained  oil after years of kitchen use, the legs rarely get cleaned so they get a small level of protection.
    It doesn’t have to be direct contact with the steel to cause the problem, it’s worth checking to see if the contamination is worse at the bottom, getting less higher up.
  7. With 430 steel the parameters for the ferrous content can vary from supplier to supplier i.e. 430 stainless steel from overseas may well have more ferrous than stainless steel manufactured in the UK. I cant remember percentages but suspect the problem is connected.
  8. We had a situation once. All grades are certified so not likely it not what it supposed to be. In our case we eventually realised the  fabricator was grinding other metals close to were the tables were being made and this contaminated the stainless. The only way this was cured was to completely re polish the stainless with an industrial polisher.
  9. A photo of the problem might be helpful as it would possibly confirm if the problem is due to Electrolytic action by dissimilar metals. This could show itself as a “blueing” effect, pitting would certainly indicate the presence of some form of stronger acid or sodium chloride (salt) solution.
    If some of the table legs are in a moist area then that might be the reason for the differing effects.
    If the legs have been independently tested then I would have expected the metallurgist to have explained the possibilities. As always I would be pleased to talk it through with the member but it is a long time ago since I took my exams in Metallurgy.
  10. We have always used 430 for our frames/undershelves without a problem. The only similar experience I had was a few years ago when a client was complaining that the stainless steel fabrications we had installed were ‘rusting’. We too had used the same fabrication supplier for years without any problems, so though it was a little strange. It turned out that they were not properly rinsing off the cleaning products (detergents and/or bleach) during normal washing down and the problem was being caused by the residual product left on the surface of the stainless. This was resolved by cleaning the contamination off with a very fine wire wool and ensuring proper washing down with fresh water during cleaning. As far as I know this resolved their issue.
    Hope that this may help somewhat.

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Q3 confidence survey shows further positive sales

ceda members appear to be continuing an upward quarter-by-quarter trend. Results from the recent Q3 confidence survey show 54% of ceda members are experiencing positive growth against the previous quarter.

How did your sales for the last quarter compare with the previous quarter?

Similarly, 52% of the ceda membership reported better year-on-year sales when comparing Q3 in 2016 with Q3 in 2017.

How did your sales for the last quarter compare with the same quarter in previous year?

Year-to-date sales are also better for 54% of those surveyed. Whilst uncertainty still remains over the UK's Brexit negotiations, the results show increased confidence in the industry when compared to the same quarter in 2016, just after the Leave vote.

How do your year-to-date sales for this current year compare with your year-to-date last year?

Cautious optimism also appears to be prevalent in forecast sales for Q4. 46% of ceda members predict better sales, compared to Q3 and 33% expect sales to remain the same.

How do you forecast your sales for the next quarter compared with the previous quarter?

What is clear from all the results gathered from the Q3 survey is steady growth across the industry. As in other recent surveys, the majority of sales and enquiries recorded by ceda members from both the public and private sectors are consistent. Restaurants continue to dominate private sector enquiries and we hope ceda members can galvanise this trend by putting their names in front of the booming UK restaurant scene.

Discussions at the recent ceda Southern and Northern Regional Meetings also reflect these results, with members North and South experiencing steady growth, optimism for the future and an excitement for the industry as a whole.


food service equipment

ceda Launches Solid Fuel Fired Catering Equipment Industry Guidelines

Solid fuel fired catering equipment has seen a huge increase in popularity in the last couple of years and ceda’s technical support advisor, Peter Kay, is frequently asked for information on the industry regulations relating to the use and installation of this type of equipment in commercial kitchens.

With no “ready-made” document available, Peter has spent the last 18 months in close collaboration with HETAS (www.hetas.co.uk) to produce some much-needed industry guidelines. These are in harmony with the latest version of DW172, the specification for commercial kitchen ventilation systems.

There are a number of risks associated with this type of equipment including:

  • Production of carbon monoxide
  • Sparks from the fuels being burned
  • Very high temperature exhaust fumes

Aimed at a broad cross section of the industry, the guide is recommended for foodservice operators, kitchen design teams, equipment suppliers and installers, ventilation designers and engineers, maintenance engineers and ventilation cleaning specialists.

Topics covered include all aspects of equipment selection and positioning, ventilation, fire suppression, equipment operation, fuel types plus storage and handling, cleaning equipment and ductwork and maintenance issues.

ceda expects the guide to become the “go to” document for the industry.

The document entitled “Guidance on best practice for the safe installation, operation and maintenance of solid fuel fired catering equipment in commercial premises” is available from ceda for a cost of £50. To order a copy please visit our website www.ceda.co.uk/contact-us/ or contact us on 01386 793911 or by email at info@ceda.co.uk.


ceda Silver Partners BOSS Contract Furniture Ltd kit-out Sandbanks Hotel

ceda Silver Partners, BOSS Contract Furniture Ltd, have just completed a full supply of furniture to all public areas at the famous Sandbanks Hotel in Poole, Dorset.

This project included furniture for the hotel's main restaurant, bar, lounges, conservatory, reception and coffee areas.

Tables and chairs were supplied for the restaurant, sofas, tub chairs and coffee tables for the bar and three-seater sofas, lounge chairs and coffee tables for the lounges, conservatory, reception and coffee areas.

All furniture for the project was supplied through a local distributor who also gave BOSS the lead and asked them to be their furniture experts to secure this large furniture project.

We are told that BOSS will be the furniture suppliers for any future requirements for Sandbanks or any of their other group hotels.


Question

Question

We have a customer looking to have a maintenance on an LPG mobile catering van at a large site in Fife and have a certificate issued. Can you ask our associates if anyone can carry out this work or if they can recommend anyone.

Replies

  1. Speak to Ben at NWCE – http://www.nwce.co.uk/
  2. Check on Ncass website for nearest LPG mobile catering engineer.
  3. Catering Supply and Repairs have an engineer who is available to help.www.csr-ltd.co.ukT: 01324 552601 (Option 1)
  4. Catering Supplies & Repairs – 01324 552601 option 1
  5. They could try Kingston Catering his name is Robert on 07811 368955 he says he has the relevant qualification, but they must carry out due diligence themselves.

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Question

Question

Does anyone know who makes/imports something like these copper pans ideally for use with induction but if not just use with ceran plates. Thank you

Replies

  1. Try Paula Shirlock – paula.sherlock@signature-fse.com – not sure that it’s specific to the style but we have used copper pans on both induction and electric / Gas appliances. she only works through distribution.
  2. Far East Industries Ltd.
  3. The only supplier I could think of was Mauviel, they don’t have that exact one as your pic.2153‘You could be perhaps interested in our hammered Items ? you will find this product in our M’Tradition collection (see above picture).’

    Contact details below should you want to get in touch – Myriam GACEM m.gacem@mauviel.com

  4. Please refer to http://skyra.in/skyserv-induction-chafers

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Items for discussion at the ceda November meetings

As you know, we have three meetings coming up in November:

  • 8th November – Technical Steering Group
  • 15th November – Southern Regional Meeting
  • 22nd November – Northern Regional Meeting

If you have any items that you would like to raise for discussion or action at any of these meetings, we do have time factored into the Agendas to do so and if we have notice, we can prepare and research the topics.

Whether it’s challenges or issues that you are facing with suppliers, customers, technical support or any third party provider and you would like it addressed, please do email FionaPeter or Adam directly with your thoughts and concerns and we can make time in the meeting schedules to raise the matter.

Anonymity can be granted if required! We look forward to hearing from you and for your contribution.


The ceda Technical Awards

The ceda Technical Awards were introduced last year to recognise and reward outstanding achievements by ceda members and suppliers.

Awards were present at an awards evening following The Catering Equipment Industry Technical Conference in Nottingham on 11th October. There were two awards for individuals and one for a member company as well as one for a supplier.

The first award was the Technical Rising Star award which recognises someone who has been in their current job for less than 5 years and who has made a significant difference to the service to a member’s customers. The judges shortlisted two candidates for this award:

 

Matthew Bridges – HB Catering and Refrigeration Ltd
Matt joined HB as a mature apprentice having been to university where he gained a degree in Design Technology before undertaking several courses as he was keen to get into the fire service. He came to the attention HB as his father is a refrigeration engineer with whom some of HB’s senior engineers had apprenticed with and as the fire service was not recruiting, Matt was looking for an apprenticeship. Since joining the company he has progressed quickly to achieve his gas and refrigeration accreditations and is now working as an installation engineer responsible for sourcing all the material, arranging deliveries and accommodation for himself and other engineers and doing commissioning and handover to clients. One client, Chris Ferriday Head of Property for Brains Brewery said, “Can you please pass on a personal thank you to Matt Bridges who carried out the training at the Dock on Monday. I was extremely impressed with the confidence of the detailed delivery of training that was provided to the Operational management team”. His MD describes him as a great asset to the company.

Sam Howe -  Court Catering Equipment Ltd
Sam came into the company as a trainee engineer in 2013. Prior to joining the business Sam had qualified as a water sports instructor however he realised that he had very limited opportunities in that sector. Sam is now a fully qualified gas and electrical catering engineer. He is by his own admission not the finished article, as he wants to progress further with dishwasher work but has really shone as of late in the department by furthering his career and undertaking his comcat 5 and LPG gas tickets this year. He is always willing to learn and go that extra step to ensure any job is completed to the best of his ability. Sam has been out on his own for the last 18 months and has really become a key valuable member of the Court team.

The winner was Matt Bridges who received a top of the range Kane flue gas analyser donated by Commercial Catering Spares.

The second individual award was for the Apprentice of the Year. The two candidates considered for this award were:

 

Scott Jordan – Airedale Technical Care
Scott joined the company in 2016 at the age of 18 and was initially mentored by a number of experienced engineers to the point that by 2016 he had achieved his Gas ACS Accreditations, however, it was clear that there was an attitude issue with Scott not wanting to be late home and avoiding early starts in a morning. After a review meeting with his Technical Manager it was made clear that things would have to change if he was to succeed in the Hospitality industry which is 24/7. Since that day, he has embraced all the challenges presented to him and now always goes the extra mile to ensure the customer gets the best possible service.

Andy Smith – Court Catering Equipment Ltd
Andy joined court in 2012 as a dishwasher engineer having had some experience in this area but having previously worked as a French polisher and a golf instructor, jobs far removed from the role of a catering service engineer. The company very quickly realised that he was capable of much more and therefore put him onto a fast track training schedule with a senior engineer since when he has achieved his full Natural and LP Gas Com-Cat Accreditations, attended several manufacturers’ courses and is already progressed to the stage where he is training another engineer.

The winner was Scott Jordan who receives £500 worth of tools donated by First Choice Catering Spares

 

The ceda member company award is the Groundbreaker Award. This award is to recognise and reward a technical initiative that has been introduced by a member which benefits their customers. The judges again shortlisted two entries;

 

Vision Commercial Kitchens – for the Catering Engineer UK Forum
What was initially intended as a means of finding engineers who could carry out maintenance and repair work for Vision has now developed into a busy forum where engineers can seek help from other engineers resulting in faster fault diagnosis, more first time fixes and less recalls, all of which benefit customers. One ceda member who uses the forum describes it as “a priceless tool which is used by over 500 engineers”.

CHR Equipment – for developing flood proof induction technology
Following the devastating floods caused by storm Desmond in December 2015, the all electric cooking suite at the Castle Dairy restaurant in Kendal was damaged beyond repair and the restaurant’s insurers were not willing to provide new cover unless the client could guarantee that the replacement equipment was “flood proof”. CHR not only designed unique Induction Cooking facilities in which the main components were housed at high level but also built into the cooking suite a platform lift which could raise the unit above flood water levels.

The winner was Vision Commercial Kitchens.

The above awards were judged by Nick Oryino, Chairman of the Catering Engineers Standards and Regulations Board and Jonathan Booth, Managing Director of Commercial Catering Spares.

The supplier award was to recognise outstanding technical support to ceda members and particularly their engineers.  This award was voted for by ceda members and the top three companies were:

First Choice Catering Spares
Maidaid – Halcyon
Meiko UK
The winner was Meiko UK Ltd


The Catering Equipment Industry Technical Conference

Last week (11th October 2017) saw us host The Catering Equipment Industry Technical Conference, a conference we jointly organise with CESA. The theme for this year's conference was “Focus on the Future”.

The conference included two “firsts” namely the launch of the new DW172 “Specification for Kitchen Ventilation Systems” which was introduced by Peter Rogers of BESA and the launch of a new document entitled “Guidance on best practice for the safe installation, operation and maintenance of solid fuel fired catering equipment in commercial premises” which has been jointly produced by ceda and HETAS. This was delivered by Peter Kay of ceda.

Other sessions covered Apprenticeships, Updates on Regulations and Standards and an update on the ceda/CESA Engineer Training courses which are delivered by our licensee Combico.

One of the highlights of the day was a Q&A session relating to manufacturers’ warranties where it became clear that most distributors were dissatisfied with many manufacturers’ policies and performance. ceda will be working closely with members and partners to try to develop a standard or set of options that meet everyone’s requirements.

We had two seminars; one covering water quality within food service and the effect water has on equipment led by Steve Buckmaster of BRITA; and recruitment and training of ex forces personnel as service engineers led by Tony Mooney of Live the Dream with support from Martin Dagnall of Combico.

Delegates could also have one-to-one meetings with specialists on such topics as Refrigeration, The Gas Regulations, Warewashing problems and Apprenticeships.  The conference was hosted by Richard West who also delivered an interesting session highlighting how some companies are thinking outside the box when planning for the future.

Nick Oryino, Chairman of the Catering Engineers Standards and Regulations Board said that the conference was the best he had ever attended adding that every presentation was very interesting and held his attention.

Following the conference business day there was an awards dinner, details of which can be found here.


Question

Question

Does any of our members have a good contact that can help with the disposal of old commercial refrigeration units as we are constantly asked to remove old when supplying replacements?

Replies

  1. Fosters and Williams do good rate if replacing with theirs or CEF but over £150 unit.
  2. All the fridge manufacturers or wholesalers would remove for a set price. For instance Foster charge £58 per cabinet to remove environmentally if they are delivering a new cabinet at the same time. Prices vary according according to the supplier.
  3. When supply replacements – get the manufacturer to pick up the old unit.
  4. We have tended to have the old uplifted with the new cabinet being supplied and charged for the services accordingly.
  5. It depends upon the members location of course but we use Pentland Wholesale who charge £40 per cabinet.
  6. We use HLCE Group, they are very reliable and dispose of units in an environmentally safe way.  Their number is 01162 602222 or 01162 601133.
  7. Fosters will take away and dispose for a nominal fee if its their kit that’s being delivererd (I believe Gram and Williams offer a similar deal).
    Otherwise I use our logistics company IAC to take them away and dispose of them (and yes usually its part of a refurb so we put the old fridges to one side and they collect them when they do the delivery of the new stuff – I only pay about £30 for them to take away, degas and dispose).
  8. We have had many issues over the last few years with this so always quote the suppliers disposal service as an option to the customer.
    Most collect an old unit on delivery of the new it just has to be outside ready to be taken.
  9. Ask them to check out a company called Cool Concerns or Solutions they used to dispose of all our stuff across the country.
  10. Although does come with a cost we usually get the manufacturer/supplier to take the old away when delivering the new.

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